Future Project

[hammerhead]

I'm planning a new mustang project - have been for a while now and it may get off the ground soon - but find myself at a cross roads - New technology is coming down the pipe fast - Toyota is already producing Hydrogen cars and I think by 2024 maybe 2025 the V8 internal combustion may go the way of the dodo - I think this is evident with the new Bronco (small engine options) - My main concern is dumping a lot of cash into what is now, old horsepower only to have it banned or some other ridiculous reason the gov can come up with to keep them off the road....The GTA is currently planning three hydrogen fill stations (if they haven't been installed already)

Wondering what everyone's thoughts are on the near future and the automobile??? What do you know?? What do you see?? What do you like?? We have a lot of dealer guys here maybe you can enlighten us...or are the manufacturing companies as conflicted as I?

[Laffs]

I think by 2024 maybe 2025 the V8 internal combustion may go the way of the dodo

Most OEM's are targeting 10 years past that as the phase out date on ICE vehicle sales, and that is admittedly optimistic by their own accounts. Power Grids and charging stations are not there yet for widespread EV use, getting that infrastructure in place first is the most important step and that itself can take a decade plus. They aren't going to flip the switch in one fell swoop.

[hammerhead]

I've read not too long ago the production of ICE will go to 2050 in Europe - but I'm thinking the numbers will decrease as the ev's and hydrogen increase - it also stated diesel will phase out first - there was also talk of a particulate exhaust filter that may be installed to the future ICE engines as it stated they currently can't make them any cleaner or efficient than they already are - similar filter to modern diesel and will need regular cleaning or replacement (they are not fun) - it's expected that ev''s will really begin to take up much of the market share starting 2024 - I think the covid may have slowed things down a little - it looks like the Japanese makers are going to go full bore with hydrogen Toyota, Hyundai, Kia, maybe Mazda, that infrastructure is not widely available here yet - Hydrogen will out range EV's - I think this scare Musk as he has been trying to down play hydrogen as being viable - it seems like a mixed bag of chaos for at least the next ten years

[Ponyryd]

What kind of project are you planning? There are companies making electric powertrains if you’re into that sort of thing..........imo ICE will be around from major manufacturers for at least the next 20 years, but it all depends on your plans. To me it’s a waste to do anything cool and not have it powered by gas or diesel (Cummins 4bt is a cool option that will have aftermarket support forever), but I’m not big on electric cars, or hydrogen.

[hammerhead]

What kind of project are you planning? There are companies making electric powertrains if you’re into that sort of thing..........imo ICE will be around from major manufacturers for at least the next 20 years, but it all depends on your plans. To me it’s a waste to do anything cool and not have it powered by gas or diesel (Cummins 4bt is a cool option that will have aftermarket support forever), but I’m not big on electric cars, or hydrogen.

I want to build a race car with a fox that has been sitting around for a while now, sort of a GT division car (road course) - I'm fascinated with all the new tech. but electric is out for me and hydrogen is too new. I can't see hydrogen being retro fit friendly - I saw the setup you mentioned it's cool but two laps and your done. Back yard guys in the 90's where doing that before Musk

[hsousa88]

I’m kinda at the same crossroads

I want to build a motor for the fox.. but I’m just not sure it’s worth it to me. I really feel like big changes are coming soon(ish- 10yrs) and us car guys/hobbyists/weekend warriors/w.e you wanna call it are going to be screwed.

[WidowrRacing]

I’m just waiting for Dodge to release the Caravan SRT with 702hp.

The choice of only electric cars/trucks is coming but it won’t be anytime soon.
Until that happens....give me 800hp in a Fox body and some huge drag radials.

[Ponyryd]

I want to build a race car with a fox that has been sitting around for a while now, sort of a GT division car (road course) - I'm fascinated with all the new tech. but electric is out for me and hydrogen is too new. I can't see hydrogen being retro fit friendly - I saw the setup you mentioned it's cool but two laps and your done. Back yard guys in the 90's where doing that before Musk

All I can say is get off your ass and get going on it so you can enjoy it before the Liberals of the world take away everything we love. Enjoy life while you can.
To me it needs a V8 and a stick, but I’m a bit old-school.

[hammerhead]

All I can say is get off your ass and get going on it so you can enjoy it before the Liberals of the world take away everything we love. Enjoy life while you can.
To me it needs a V8 and a stick, but I’m a bit old-school.

hahaha me too was planning modern v8 and a stick - it should get under way this summer finishing up some projects and the mule car '79 pace, oh yah room is an issue too - it will be a long process

[hammerhead]

I’m just waiting for Dodge to release the Caravan SRT with 702hp.

The choice of only electric cars/trucks is coming but it won’t be anytime soon.
Until that happens....give me 800hp in a Fox body and some huge drag radials.

they say 2024 electric will take off because the cost of producing batteries is coming down - but yah I think the ICE will still be around but may just small economical versions - Caravan SRT is that a thing? That would be cool rear wheel drive - I've been eyeing up the High Commanders Caravan for a viper swap...lol

[bbriann]

Personally gasoline powered vehicles work for me and see no significant reason to change. I don't believe electrical vehicles will be mainstream in the max 50 years I have left on this earth. I have been employed as a nuclear electric operator for 30 years. Every body is open to there own opinions based on what they want to believe to be truth or facts.

[Stephen06GT]

Just build the damn thing Gerry!! ;)

[Ponyryd]

they say 2024 electric will take off because the cost of producing batteries is coming down - but yah I think the ICE will still be around but may just small economical versions - Caravan SRT is that a thing? That would be cool rear wheel drive - I've been eyeing up the High Commanders Caravan for a viper swap...lol

Electric may be “taking off” because of politics-I won’t get into it here, but I highly doubt the price of them will drop very much, the batteries are still crazy expensive to build, and terribly harmful to the environment. I’m thinking if anything, electric will start taking off because of the price of fuel, which is again, because of politics.
SRT minivan doesn’t exist, and never will. Dodge does have an SRT Durango (7-pass) with a Hellcat engine. And the SRT wrangler with the 392 will be out this year.

[ZR]

Propane then Natural gas were suppose to replace Gasoline a whole bunch years ago. Can't imagine the millions they pissed away on building fueling stations, subsidized conversions yet gasoline is still at the forefront.
Build or buy what floats your boat, never a time doing something that makes you happy made more sense.

[hammerhead]

I remember propane setups in duel fuel vehicles - they have similar setups for hydrogen/gasoline duel fuel ICE engines - I wonder if this fuel system needs an annual inspection on the Hydrogen side as the propane needed in the past - we may see a resurgence in propane. remember all the city cabs had duel fuel...lol

[hammerhead]

Just build the damn thing Gerry!! ;)

I wanted to build a 3000 square foot shop but the High Commander thought we needed a new kitchen more...

[ZR]

I remember propane setups in duel fuel vehicles - they have similar setups for hydrogen/gasoline duel fuel ICE engines - I wonder if this fuel system needs an annual inspection on the Hydrogen side as the propane needed in the past - we may see a resurgence in propane. remember all the city cabs had duel fuel...lol


I had a couple or three dual fuel tow trucks. Worked about on par with diesel for economy but amount of space the tank took up was a pain. Stuck with dual fuel for cold weather starting plus gave it good range.

[RedSN]

Politics aside, something to be said about the simplicity of an electric motor.
A V8 has what? Over a hundred major moving parts? Pistons accelerating, then decelerating, stopping, changing directions and doing it all over again dozens of times a second.
An electric motor has one major moving part. It just spins.

You want to build something cool... try no moving parts!
Pulse jet powered car!

https://media.wired.com/photos/59095df0d8c8646f38eef7f0/master/w_1600%2Cc_limit/Worlds-only-Pulsejet-lakester-for-sale-on-Ebay-Recovered.gif

[redo75]

Maybe I am over thinking the electric car, sitting with a ton of batteries underneath me. Years ago in London studies were done about people living in close proximity to hi-voltage transmission lines. Not sure of the final results but higher levels of sickness, birth defects and child learning was thrown around.
I wonder if some form of shielding is built in?
Lastly some kid cracked up a TESLA in Cali last year I believe and clean up was put on hold as the batteries were too hot to handle days after at the scene.

[Ponyryd]

I remember propane setups in duel fuel vehicles - they have similar setups for hydrogen/gasoline duel fuel ICE engines - I wonder if this fuel system needs an annual inspection on the Hydrogen side as the propane needed in the past - we may see a resurgence in propane. remember all the city cabs had duel fuel...lol

Propane systems need inspection every 10 years....actually maybe not the system, but the tanks for sure, although I doubt anyone polices this.

[hammerhead]

Politics aside, something to be said about the simplicity of an electric motor.
A V8 has what? Over a hundred major moving parts? Pistons accelerating, then decelerating, stopping, changing directions and doing it all over again dozens of times a second.
An electric motor has one major moving part. It just spins.

You want to build something cool... try no moving parts!
Pulse jet powered car!

https://media.wired.com/photos/59095df0d8c8646f38eef7f0/master/w_1600%2Cc_limit/Worlds-only-Pulsejet-lakester-for-sale-on-Ebay-Recovered.gif

He’s running the wrong way if he wants to win the race lmao hahaha - for drag racing I thinks electric will kick ass and end the sport as long as they calm down warm up the tires real good and hang on and laugh like the devil hahaha

[hammerhead]

I understand how simple electric cars are I don’t understand the purchase price for one considering the simplicity

[92redragtop]

Scale?

[Ponyryd]

I understand how simple electric cars are I don’t understand the purchase price for one considering the simplicity

Much of the cost is in the batteries. The materials are mined by people, and there are many environmental considerations, making it very costly.

[83 5.0]

Much of the cost is in the batteries. The materials are mined by people, and there are many environmental considerations, making it very costly.

I have always wonder if there is enough material in the earth to support building all these batteries, as they use a lot of rare earth types.

I have always thought about a project using a 4 or 6 cylinder, and supercharging or turbo to achieve the horse power, similar to Fords Eco Boost engines, where they position them as V8 replacements.

[Ponyryd]

I have always wonder if there is enough material in the earth to support building all these batteries, as they use a lot of rare earth types.

I have always thought about a project using a 4 or 6 cylinder, and supercharging or turbo to achieve the horse power, similar to Fords Eco Boost engines, where they position them as V8 replacements.

A lot of the materials comes from underdeveloped countries, but there appears to be plenty of raw material currently available, of course it comes at a great cost, that most don’t know, or care about.

Personally I love seeing different swaps, and the 4-cyl ecoboost is becoming a very common swap engine, as well as the 3.5 and 2.7. There are also engines from GM that are very potent (ecotec 4 cyl), and plenty of other options.

[RedSN]

*deleted
Not getting into the pointless argument about electric vehicles

[hammerhead]

I won't be going electric or hydrogen but we may have to concede one day as a daily driver and keep the cool cars for off road who knows - I just read a story the other day that ford is investing heavy to have a wide range of electric cars by 2025 including the Mach E (i dont know this Mach E may be the next gen Mustang...lol - Maybe they will have the Electric Eel model and the Super Electric Eel and drop the snake.....lol) The electric f150 is said to be out in 2022 and I recently saw the Seirra electric version - I want at least 500hp - naturally aspirated - will be fuel injection - tossed between building an old iron block or getting a coyote - would love a flat plane crank engine but a little pricey - anyone I've every known who put 500 plus hp into a four cylinder didn't have an engine for very long - had a friend with a 800 hp subbie the engine ran great all kinds of sensors but crapped out some valves when an issue with the tranny ultimately effected the engine - V8's are also susceptible, have a friend with a Hellcat hit a large puddle on one side that jammed the power steering box that momentarily mistimed the engine, I guess with forces from the belts and pulleys and crapped out the valves - mustangs with electric steering likely a better choice...no electric race cars...lol and no discussions on solar panels batteries or lithium I have no interest in any of it - I'm just wondering if the hobby as we know it is at a loss....

[redo75]

For us older guys this is the same argument as buying tools with life time warranties, or a life time sentence in prison.
Ha Ha!!

[hammerhead]

22984

www.racecar-engineering.com/articles/dunlop-125-future-racing-cars

cool story and it's mostly in English considering the rag it came from...lol - one part that intrigued me was virtual racing alongside the pro's in a actual race - may have to take up gaming -