Alternator? 1967 Mustang coupe 289 - battery drain - troubleshooting.

[mustang sally]

Hey Guys,
Ok got some trouble shooting done. Cleaned all the cables, wiggled a bunch of stuff, cleaned and scrubbed the battery cables, checked the negative ground (I know just because it's in place doesn't mean it's good).

Charged the battery and was able to set up my video cam so I could see what was happening on start up and rev.

I have link to what I recorded on the camera while starting it - I know, I know, I was too dainty starting it!

I can save you time with the video and say that 12.10 is the highest reading when giving it throttle - and checked it at different throttle speeds.

Bad alternator?

Here's the vid if you have time to look at the numbers (it's less than 2 minutes if you skip me starting it three times)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywQB2BPEslc&t=2s

[ZR]

Your alternator is not charging at all.
Stock set up is borderline even when they were new n working properly. Suggest, upgrade to at least a 100amp single wire n put the issue behind you once and for all. Engine will run and idle better plus your head n tail lights will be appreciably brighter at night.

[ZR]

Good read here.

http://www.stangtv.com/tech-stories/electronics-efi/biting-the-bullitts-powermaster-140-amp-alternator-upgrade/

[mustang sally]

Thanks Rick - I feel better having that confirmed. That was a really good read - almost made me feel like I could hook one up myself! But probably taking it to the local shop so I can at least see how it's done so that I know for future.

I am thinking since the alternator runs the car and the alternator isn't charing, it's not likely it will get me 10 minutes to the shop without totally cutting out?

hmmm, maybe I will be putting this in myself after all lol.

[ZR]

On a fully charged battery, will easily make a 20 minute drive (lights n heater off of course)

[mustang sally]

On a fully charged battery, will easily make a 20 minute drive (lights n heater off of course)

Ok that's really good to know.

Do you recommend the Powermaster one wire alternators?

I am just checking around to see where to pick one up

(geeze wish I could get up to for this but I guess alternators are kind of like emergency surgery lol - but I will get up to you for my power steering and breaks conversion if I keep getting saying work over the summer)

(I am just reading how to bypass the external voltage regulator when these new ones go in)

[ZR]

Like anything else electrical, can be a hit or miss but generally pretty decent.

[mustang sally]

Like anything else electrical, can be a hit or miss but generally pretty decent.

Ok that's great - thanks again.

[Old Fart]

Congrats on making some progress!

[mustang sally]

Congrats on making some progress!

Thanks Mike - it's a great feeling since I hadn't had much experience wrenching before. I tend to overthink these things and then have to make sure I have a huge amount of time to work through something in case I make a mistake and make things worse lol!

[mustang sally]

So been doing some research on alternator upgrades. I have been reading about what seem to be two different types of alternators:
1) the 3G alts with basic OE specs but offered with the increased amperage which I would definitely want
2) then the 'one wire' alts -

Am I correct in my understanding that all aftermarket one-wire alts are at least 3G but that not all 3G's are one-wire alts (well, actually two wires, one wire to battery and one to ground?)

So far I do mostly city driving - not hugely long trips until I get the coin to get all my safety stuff in place (3-point belts, head rests etc) - is there a benefit of the one-wire alt over the 3G with OE specs? I know the 3G has the internal VR which would be one huge less thing to worry about. But is it correct that one has to be driving a certain amount in order for the one-wire to start charging the battery.

I understand that the 3G's require the #4 gauge to allow for the additional current.

But that's as far as my understanding gets me about which alt to select for my driving needs - and then I hit another learning curve!! lol.

A big concern is not wanting to hack into my current wiring but making sure I am driving enough right now to not continue to have charging issues.

[ZR]

One wire alt is typically energized at approx 1000 rpm n stays engaged until the engine is shut off.
Either one your looking at is a good option.

[mustang sally]

Hey Guys,
This is a 3 wire alt correct and not a one-wire? (still a bit confused even after all this researching).

Getting ready to test the VR before springing for a new alt system - or having it towed up to Rick's because I think my eyes are crossing now lol

http://www.paperformance.com/95a-3g-alternator-1614e/

Here's the conversion kit they recommend with this:
http://www.paperformance.com/1g-3g-conversion-462802c/

And the increased capacity wire.
http://www.paperformance.com/standard-short-9904/

Good option or ...

[Old Fart]

Can't really answer since I did the Cougar's 3G swap with scrapyard pieces and welding wire, lol! Your idea of towing it to Rick's shop is a good one.

[mustang sally]

Your idea of towing it to Rick's shop is a good one.

LOL, I am totally almost at the end of my learning curve! Humbling for sure but I guess that's what learning feels like eh!

[ZR]

Take a look here, easy to install / requires power wire to battery only and your done.

http://www.cjponyparts.com/powermaster-alternator-100-amp-one-wire-v-belt-pulley-smooth-look-1965-1973/p/ALT38-V/

[mustang sally]

Take a look here, easy to install / requires power wire to battery only and your done.

http://www.cjponyparts.com/powermaster-alternator-100-amp-one-wire-v-belt-pulley-smooth-look-1965-1973/p/ALT38-V/

perfect, thanks Rick.

[steam_mill]

I believe you have an external voltage regulator. That could cause the issues you are describing.

I have an '85. Last year I think of the external regulator with a 1G 65 amp alternator. I have power windows/locks, have AC which works. 400 watt stereo and powered bazooka. Never an issue. I did blow the voltage requlator when I reversed the battery polarity (don't ask).

[mustang sally]

I believe you have an external voltage regulator. That could cause the issues you are describing.

I did blow the voltage requlator when I reversed the battery polarity (don't ask).

Thanks steam_mill
LOL, ok, I totally won't ask - but it sounds like something that makes me feel better about my work so far lol.

yes, my VR is external - last night I tried to pull it from the holder but I was being too gingerly so as not to break anything. So tonight before the sun goes down I will try again with a little more force.

Also realizing troubleshooting with only two hands was causing me some logistical issues - I think I have a strategy now re getting the jumper wire to stay put on the VR while I jump it, give it a bit of throttle from the engine side to raise the rpm's and video the volts on the battery so that I can actually see what it's registering.

The one-wire alt that Rick sent the link for is something I can tackle now that I know what should be happening. So now just a decision if it turns out to be the alternator between the one-wire and the 95A 3G from pa performance. The one wire is sure a lot less compacted and less expensive especially with the CAD-US dollar right now.

If it's the VR I will go with a new electronic one instead of the old style. That's also something I can do myself. And it it's a wiring or ground issue, well, that will be a whole new learning curve.

[mustang sally]

Update:
Turned out to be the alternator.
I jumped the VR, made sure all connections were clean and tight. I have the old alternator out now and am studying the process of putting a new one in.

(Got a rubber hammer just in case...)

This has been easier than I thought - the biggest issue is never having done any of this before.

Thanks again for all your help.

[mustang sally]

Sorry for the late update - working crazy hours and working some more crazy hours to pay for the stuff I want to do with the car.

Ok so retested the alt one more time and the VR one more time - and it turned out it was the VR - ordered the electric (digital??) one and all was fine.

Latest challenge is replacing the old alternator belt - some of my starting problems and hard starting when hot I think is related to the belt at the end of its life and slipping although no sounds.

Headed out to Can tire or part source to grab a new one tomorrow. On the road and loving it.

Can't find any youtube videos on replacing the belt - any tips I need to know or is it pretty straight forward? (my car has no A/C or power steering.)

[ZR]

Pretty straight forward job.

[Old Fart]

I think you might need a pry bar to get the belt tight enough.

[mustang sally]

I think you might need a pry bar to get the belt tight enough.

Thanks Mike, I have a pry bar and I know that I need to lift the alternator up to tighten the belt. But to replace the belt and perform the finer tuned stuff is hard to find out there in my research - and I sure do research the hell out of things. So I come here to where the expertise is.

Just trying to find some step by step stuff or vids to watch as I am visual learner. Willing to learn and try things and I have learned a lot but when I hit a snag I am always willing to ask for help.

I guess most people assume dudes already know how to do this stuff or are maybe tired of explaining the same things. I understand that.

I have noticed though that when people know I am a chick, they are more prone to tell me to go to a mechanic which I don't see them saying too much to the dudes.

I guess it just comes with the territory lol.

[Old Fart]

What do you need to know about changing the belt? I could provide the step by step stuff if you want.

[mustang sally]

Hi Mike,
Thanks for your post and offer. I have never done it before so I am starting from scratch - I haven't even taken one off before. I ordered one from the parts store and then started researching how to do it. That's when I realized I wasn't having luck finding any good vids or instructions on how to take one off and put one on.

If you had the time, I would sure appreciate the step by step. My car is without a/c and without power steering.
Thanks again Mike - I appreciate your taking the time to reply.

[Old Fart]

Hey Sally...pm'd you.

[mustang sally]

Thank you so much Mike for your kindness. It was exactly what I needed and couldn't locate anywhere in my research. I will get started tomorrow. Much obliged.